Return to Article: Employee groups push SES diversity bill
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85236
I've seen a fair amount of discrimination and racist comments, but some of you are pretty shocking.... Whew!
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83845
Wow, these comments are incredibly offensive. I wonder how many of the commenters are white heterosexual Christian males in the baby boomer generation?
It's the 21st century, fellas. Get over yourselves.
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81237
A minority defends their race and it is defined as admirable, valiant, praised as a great civil leader.
A white defends their race and he is a racist?????
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81224
My Supervisor is a GS 15 Latino Woman and her boss ,an SESer, is a Black Male. Both of these indiviuals are bright and sharp and I enjoy working for them. But please stop say there are no or few minorities in Leadership. It simply is not true....at least not in the DC area.
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81189
quota, pronounced \'kwo-te\: A modern tool used to promote or hire lesser-qualified applicants who would normally not get promoted or hired under fair, merit based procedures. See also: diversity.
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81152
"Quotas are against the law yet this congress fails to understand the constitution. Right now 18% of the fed work force is black, that's not by accident its a quota hiring preference."
Yeah, and they are all either a GS 4, 5, or 6 at the most. In 22 years I have NEVER met a Black SES. But I have met many lower-graded Blacks with bachelor degrees and higher! I have met many higher graded Whites, many of whom only have high school. Go figure, with such a fair and equitable hiring and advancement system, how can these disparities exist? I suppose the Fed workforce is supposed to be lily-white as no one else would get in without these so-called quotas.
Stay off the racist stuff Dan. It's offensive, and has no basis in fact anyway.
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81081
I see - so "whitey" has to view all applicants equally while the minorities on these boards can chose one of their own? So explain to me how this is not discrimination. Is it only discrimination when and if white people chose another white person over a minority? I've recently hired two high level people in my office - one African American and one Korean American the reason for my decision was not based on quotas but on their qualifications. If we truly want to get rid of racism in this country we need to quit "segregating" groups of people for special treatment and consideration. (Except for Vets - those individuals have truly served our country)
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81075
Quotas are against the law yet this congress fails to understand the constitution. Right now 18% of the fed work force is black, that's not by accident its a quota hiring preference.
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81067
My boss refused to submit me for the Executive Development Program-and I have had Superior ratings the last two years. He said its because we are reorganizing-but theres been no written notice of it. Now what do I do with 10+ years of private sector management experience and 7+ years in the govt, and an MBA? OPM needs to understand that qualifications, education, experience and great references have nothing to do with getting into Management or the SES.
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81064
I feel that many of the readers are missing the point of these programs. I have seen in my career situations where employees were given preference in terms of training opportunites and job assignments. Then when it comes time for a promotion, is it any wonder who gets picked. I don't believe in filling the SES ranks with women and minorities just because they are women and minorities. BUT I do believe that if women and minorities are given the same developmental opportunities (and mentoring support) than their white male counterparts received, it is very likely when that promotion opportunity comes up they will be chosen, and will probably do just as good a job or better than their white male counterparts. Our last president was a white male; he came into office with a healthy economy and after 8 years, we will be decades picking up the pieces. Seems maybe we need to look elsewhere in the population for talent.
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81059
I view SES as a reward and not an achievement. We need best qualified for these positions, not "club" members.
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81058
Diversity? Discrimination? Let me tell you a little story....I am an Black Female and I went to an HBCU, and one day while in class, a white woman asked me why is it that in that particular class, did the instructor only give reading material by black authors? I looked at her, and never answered - but I wondered why in my 12 years of school was I only given white books with white authors? My point? We little Americans with our little minds will always be what we have always been. Reverse Discrimination, or Front Discrimination. We will always have someone in America discriminating. Deal with it!
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81055
I guess when you no longer have competent personnel you go the affermative action route. E.g look at the latest Supreme Court nominee, and she is a self proclaimed product of AffAc. Who need knowledge or experience when you have minority experience to draw upon.
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81051
The problem is not with not being able to find competent managers, it's with the integrity of the selection process that has led to the incompetence of our leadership in the government -it is truly "who you know" in addition to the process for getting in the SES being entirely too easy. If you know the hiring official and hire someone to write a good slick response (often overly embellished) to the ECQ's, you are in -just like that. (Yet someone applying for a clerical or GS-5 or GS-7) entry level job has to answer hundreds of questions).
I think there should be a complete overhall of the SES selection process. OPM needs to quickly change the procedural process for authenicating the leadersip abilities of the prosepctive candidates - to include a rigid 3 to 5 day process which includes having the candidates respond verbally and in writing to a series of impromptu questions/scenarios from a netural diverse panel (outside of the agency for which the selection is being made). The filling of these jobs should not be a writing excercise for which the candidate has paid someone to make him/her to look good on paper. If this truly competitive process were implemented, of the 6 different agencies I have worked, very few of the current members of the SES would successfully make it through the process because they cannot think, write, or articulate on their own and thus not very capable of leading anyone anywhere. This situation with the leadership explains why we have an incompetent non-trustworthy government. If this process was implemented, I don't think we would have to worry about diversity, as it would truly result in putting the best candidate in the position.
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81047
What we need at the SES level are people that can lead. This means that they must have the ability to create followers. A majority of the current crop of SES employees function as managers. They already have managers to mange things, but for some reason, they never made the jump from manager to leader. Most SES employees barn-storm the mission. It's all about the mission and very little about the people. Those that perform leadership like a manager will continue to lose employees. It almost reminds me of American Idol. So many people think they can sing, when they really, really can not. We are not ready for diversity within SES. SES needs to be fixed before we subject diverse talent to those idiots.
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81046
This is another chapter in a sorry saga that has resulted in more enmity among colleagues, distrust of supervisors, sarcastic attitudes, and acceptance of mediocrity over the past 40 years than any other political issue I can think of. Discrimination was wrong, and it remains wrong. But the way to address that wrong is to root it out, expose it, and deal with it. Committing another wrong yields an even worse result.
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81045
Good luck Charlie, let us know how you make out!
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81039
I am 1/4 native american... does that make me a Minority? If so, maybe I should rely on my minority status to land an SES position instead of my Degree from Princeton.
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81034
Lets face it, the lack of diversity in the SES ranks has been ignored long enough. I have seen minority men in this program that don't belong. At best this program is not going to totally change the SES ranks it will add a few well deserved minorities but I doubt if it will change more then 5%, it will still be a agency that will consists of mostly white males. Also if you want to make comments like those above please don't be afraid to post your names to it so at least we will know who you are.
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81033
I am a federal employee with a disability. Although I would benefit from this program, I will emplore my elected leaders to oppose it. I have worked harder ans sacrifices more than most my whole life. It is simple but difficult; invest in oneself, add more value than anyone else, then work places where you can excel and that appreciate your value. Lastly, accept the reality of your choices and limitations.
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81032
Again, we have the conflict displayed that is inherent in the contentious concept of equality as it plays out in a supposedly meritocratic society; i.e., are we focusing on equality of opportunity or of outcomes? Because the numbers "don't come out right" in PC terms, with regard to new accessions to the SES, we're again being told that it's essential to change the process so that these outcomes indeed meet what are at bottom predetermined representation quotas of minorities and women. The supposition underlying this latest legislative initiative is clearly that true equality will only be achieved when each "protected class" group is represented in SES ranks in exactly the same (or higher, preferably) mathematical proportion to their representation in the general U.S. population. Such a supposition betokens the death knell of true equality of opportunity. This has long been the conundrum posed by the affirmative action concept. The erroneous assumption that only invidious discrimination and/or racism - whether deliberate or not - can explain why certain groups are not proportionately represented in various workforce groupings is destructive of the meritocratic principle. It would be far more honest in that case just to set up an open, overt quota system and be done with it, instead of the type of badly disguised and hypocritical subterfuge seen in the proposed legislation. However, once you do so, where do you stop? There is then every incentive for ever smaller and smaller segments of the population to demand shrilly "their" fair share in the representation lottery. That way lies chaos and the Balkanization of America.
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81031
Oh Yes! Please lets hire more women to be our leaders. Over the course of my 35 year career, women were BY FAR the worst bosses I ever had. Power mongering, deceiptful and manipulating beyond belief. Yeah, the dysfunctional Federal Government REALLY needs more them.
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81030
I'm not sure where it states in this article "minorities are given preference", and to make this perfectly clear I am not a minority. It refers to recruiting and consideration but nothing about preference.
I personally think it hits the mark and we do need to have more recruiting efforts directed at women and minorities for ES/SES positions. And if all KSA' are equal then consideration should be given to under represented classess/groups.
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81024
Why is diversity such as important virtue? Yeah, call me whatever names you like, but there are too many people in management who were diversity hires, and they are the ones you have to wonder, "What the heck are they doing in that position?" And I believe what makes them such terrible managers is that they are scared that someone in their staff will outshine them, or worse, look like a better person for their job! I've got a boss who is constantly telling us to keep her informed on everything so that she doesn't appear to be uninformed on things. Really. I've never figured out what she thinks is so wrong with answering a question by pointing out her staff member who is the subject matter expert on that topic? PLEASE, give me a chance at being a supervisor. I will surround myself with people who are smarter and brighter than me, and I will show them off every chance I get. No one should be expected to know everything. That's why we have staff. Practically NONE of the managers have had any management training here. It's amazing. Most of them should not be supervising anyone. And now you want to hire more of the best and the brightest (SES) based on diversity? As a white, middle-aged, graying male, I'll never have a chance to break into the SES ranks. I've overheard them talking amongst themselves about who will be filling what spots as they open up. No SES slots seem to be truly open to anyone. You gotta know someone, and they gotta like you a lot. Forget qualifications; aren't important.
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81023
Why is diversity such as important virtue? Yeah, call me whatever names you like, but there are too many people in management who were diversity hires, and they are the ones you have to wonder, "What the heck are they doing in that position?" And I believe what makes them such terrible managers is that they are scared that someone in their staff will outshine them, or worse, look like a better person for their job! I've got a boss who is constantly telling us to keep her informed on everything so that she doesn't appear to be uninformed on things. Really. I've never figured out what she thinks is so wrong with answering a question by pointing out her staff member who is the subject matter expert on that topic? PLEASE, give me a chance at being a supervisor. I will surround myself with people who are smarter and brighter than me, and I will show them off every chance I get. No one should be expected to know everything. That's why we have staff. Practically NONE of the managers have had any management training here. It's amazing. Most of them should not be supervising anyone. And now you want to hire more of the best and the brightest (SES) based on diversity? As a white, middle-aged, graying male, I'll never have a chance to break into the SES ranks. I've overheard them talking amongst themselves about who will be filling what spots as they open up. No SES slots seem to be truly open to anyone. You gotta know someone, and they gotta like you a lot. Forget qualifications; aren't important.
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81016
Unconstitutional and racist, just like the racist in chief Obama. I hope any white males who voted for BHO are happy to be discriminated against. Is this the change you were hoping for?
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81014
Just another reverse discrimination bill, I for one am tired of the whole "the man is keeping me down" mentality
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81011
It is unfortunate that we have to rely on a system that provides some advantage to minorities. It is also unfortunate that the system is set up so that equality in education and consideration is not given equally, across the board. Until this happens, there is a need to "level the playing field." Those that think the playing field is already leveled, obviously have not had to lose a position to someone less qualified and not a minority. This isn't whining - it is the way the system still works in some places.
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81008
What does it take to be classified as a "minority", is an Armenian American considered a minority? What about a Finnish American? How many Ukranian or Andorran Americans are there currently residing in the US....as many as African Americans or Latin Americans?
The two pertinent definitions I found were, "a part of a population differing from others in some characteristics and often subjected to differential treatment"...(this could refer to white males in this country), and "the smaller in number of two groups constituting a whole" (again, if the groups are white males and other, white males are probably a "minority"). Can all be treated equally?
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81002
Now, now children, remember the selection should be gender and color blind etc, no quotas, should be based most/best qualified etc... Some folks are bound and determined to give Diversity a bad name.
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80994
This was mentioned a year ago. Still no change.
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80986
Thank you for bringing this poorly veiled attempt to institute affirmative action to our attention. I too, will write my senators and congressman to express strong opposition and to request their continued support in defeating this. It's no wonder the government is inefficient and therefore, less effective than it should be - the focus is not on hiring the most qualified and holding people accountable. The government should not hire anyone based on diversity - they should be hiring based solely on qualifications, and in the case of the SES, a proven track record of strong leadership and successful performance - period.
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80985
Promotions based on anything other than qualifications is discrimination.
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80983
If we do not have a level of diversity in the SES ranks of certain federal agencies, it is very likely that we will not have higher level of diversity at the GS 14/15 ranks. This is especially true in DA because "the good old boy/girl networks" are keeping watch to ensure only a certain number of ethnic minorities rise to certain levels in the department--even when they are highly qualified.
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80980
What happened to hiring and promoting people based on their skill level? I understandt that we want diversity but too often this translates into quotas where good candidates are replaced by less qualified people based on their color, ethnicity or whatever. Isn't that what we should be trying to avoid in the first place?
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80976
What ever happened to awarding the job to the best qualified person? Any special recruitment initiatives should be open to all employees to be fair!
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80973
Diversity discriminates
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