Return to Article: Panel backs bill that could spell end of Defense pay system
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81967
Sen. George Voinovich, i only wish you were under the NSPS and had 20 employees to write and review. Then you sould brag that you have a full time job!!
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81063
Any idea how this will affect the IC equal of NSPS? The DCIPS program is similar and several agencies are slowly moving to it where others are already there. Any thoughts or knowledge on the subject?
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81040
Hey, Voinovich...so you like NSPS, huh? Too bad pay for performance doesn't apply to you any your GOP pals for the last eight years. You'd get NOTHING.
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81035
The primary benefit of NSPS is that it gives managment the flexibility to do whatever they please and not have to explain it. for instance, I am a YC2. Although the cap could be GS14 step 10, I have a control point at GS14 step 1. There were always rumours but I only found out about it when I reached it, and got a 1.5% pay raise, and the rest paid out in bonus. Second case in point. I know of someone that went from YA2 to YC2, but did not get any raise because it is "command policy". and yet, they can now hire retired officers directly into YA3 and YC3 spots, and don't have to explain it to anyone. yep, managment loves NSPS.
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81013
I am in upper management and at first I liked what I was being told about NSPS "pay for performance". However after living with this for a year, it needs to go. My duties as well as my employees is very routine, we do not have "projects" or "deadlines" that we can meet or exceed. We are on a schedule that we will either meet or not meet. Therefore we will never be a "5" or even possibly a "4". We will be a 3 "valued employees". I was a 3 with a kicker and 100% went to pay. Even still my pay was less than if I was a GS with a step increase. There are many more like me, NSPS must go.
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81012
I am in upper management and at first I liked what I was being told about NSPS "pay for performance". However after living with this for a year, it needs to go. My duties as well as my employees is very routine, we do not have "projects" or "deadlines" that we can meet or exceed. We are on a schedule that we will either meet or not meet. Therefore we will never be a "5" or even possibly a "4". We will be a 3 "valued employees". I was a 3 with a kicker and 100% went to pay. Even still my pay was less than if I was a GS with a step increase. There are many more like me, NSPS must go.
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81010
Whether it is the NSPS system or the GS system or some other system, the rats always find the cheese. Stated more straightforwardly, there will always be individuals that figure out how to "work the system" or "get over" under ANY system in the world. There will always be individuals who get rewarded for mediocre to poor performance just because of who they are, who they know, or some other non-performance related reason.
The problem is not the system, the problem is a lack of leadership. Supervisors who don't have the strength of character to give employees an honest appraisal and provide constructive criticism which might actually help the individual become a high performer some day. Supervisors who want to level the playing field using ratings because they don't have the courage to openly reward high performers or challenge those who can't or won't perform. Supervisors who like "Sally" or "John" and figure they need to keep giving them high ratings because they like them and want to take care of them. What's wrong with a supervisor helping an employee achieve maximum performance and then helping them move on to bigger and better things elsewhere?
Pay for performance - great idea. It should be the tenant of whatever system the Federal sector uses. For example, under GS a person in an upward mobility slot should not get a promotion just because it's time (i.e., their year at the 7 is up and now they should get their 9) nor should an employee get a 5% increase under NSPS just because they took on one additional responsibility. Pay increases - one grade to another or within grade increase or 5% increases - should be based on performance and nothing else.
When I started with the Government some years ago, my dad told me to work as hard as I could, do anything and everything I was asked to do and more, and never abuse my sick leave because I might need it some day. Now days, employees are only concerned about when their next promotion or 5% increase is due and when do they get their seat at the "big table". We've come to the place where there's no work in our workforce - only an aire of entitlement and there are few leaders in our leadership.
The system is not the problem.
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80996
I am retired military, receive a Gov't pension, but love to rail against civil servants because I am so bitter. However, in this case I strongly agree with the majority of posters here that NSPS is a terrible system and should be repealed.
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80995
NSPS is just great if you like working in a corrupt, discriminatory system where your pay is subject to the whims of favortism and with no recourse. But hey, it has the words "National Security" in it so it must be patriotic and wrapped in the American flag, right? Right.
If this is such a great system, read the comments in Govexec on any article about NSPS. Then, go and apply this system to the entire Federal workforce and not just the 200,000 poor souls within DoD, which is only a fraction of the DoD workforce. In fact, subject the military and Congress to this as well. I'm sure they'll love it just as much as most of us do.
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80967
To all those NSPS supporters....is it possible you benefit from an organization that properly implements the program as it was designed? Is it possible that your organization has competent supervisory personnel that truly understand how to use all of the management tools in NSPS? Is it possible your organization conducts the performance review without bias?
Many organizations are saddled with incompetent supervisory and management personnel. How can anyone working for an incompetent organization expect to receive a fair and impartial evaluation if their management is incapable of providing one? You all need to understand that many of us work for some very poor organizations.
While the GS system is far from perfect, it has the benefit of protecting the top notch performers from being harmed financially by incompetent supervisory and management personnel.
The problem with NSPS is that it was not designed to weed out the poor performing management personnel.
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80956
I'm retired Air Force and used to supervise federal employees under the government service program. I'm now a wage grade employee and looking forward to my first job as a supervisor. I welcome the NSPS and I'm not afraid of being discriminated against. If I don't like my boss (civilian or government job) I get a new one. None one is holding my feet to the fire.
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80949
How dare the taxpayers demand accountability. When I hired on I was guaranteed a job for life come to come and go as I please and annual raises and promotions. Congress has violated my work agreement and i won't stand for it
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80937
While NSPS may be bureaucratic overkill, a massive waste of resources, and based on the wrong premise that we work in the Greed Service (rather than Civil Service), it is not without value.
Just check the High-Three of recent NSPS retirees who are GS-15 equivalents.
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80934
Jeff, your comments sound good, ...but
Favoritism is alive and well, read what "NSPS Go Away" has said.
I can join the laughter when you talk about the rewards to "high performers only", read what "High-Performer Who Lost Pay Under NSPS" has said.
For years I've seen minorities promoted without regard to merit. Now, I see everything promoted, without regard to merit.
"Ralph" says it best that the checks and balances do not exist, and we are stupid to believe that "only the best" are promoted.
We fail to honestly agree what "best" means.
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80933
As with most things there are good and bad about NSPS. I cannot comment on anything but the exempt workforce issues where I work so I will restrict comments to that. Good: Flexibility in reassignments and PDs that don't take a week to write. (Of course we have the same mind-set in the classifying departments so it still takes over 2 months to get a classification done-yes, 2 months to classify)
Bad: It is so cumbersome our command has had to hire an entire section (of contractors!) to administer it. We have to stop work with our senior leaders (Flag/General Officers) for weeks every FY to administer it. Now they question if the pain associated with government personnel is not worth the gain. The lack of grades (1-15) also make it difficult to show professional progression to folks. We work in a rank centric environment. Moving someone from a 12 to 13 was tangible and said something. Now, our rules at least, mean that I cant offer anyone anything but new work of I move them inside their same pay band. What I hear more and more is, "what is my motivation?"
Horrible: No one has figured out, in this command, how to apply it equitably or consistently. We have a senior workforce and the demands are very dynamic. They don't have the time, nor the motivation, required to spend adjusting and crafting objectives that will accommodate the kind of work we do. Quite truthfully, anyone who has the kind of time required to self-administer NSPS is not doing the work they are hired to do.
As a mentor once said to me, and it applies to NSPS, "this juice ain't worth all that squeezing"
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80925
NSPS is a total waste of time and money. These folks spend more time keeping notes on their accomplishments and taking NSPS classes, there's no time to do their jobs. Woops, gotta go. I forgot to note what I accomplished last week.
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80917
PLEASE get rid of NSPS. No matter what anyone says, favoritism is still happening. It is de-motivating this 25 yr Fed. I'm too young to retire, but sure not motivated anymore.The favorites survive...this is not good business for the Federal employees. The favorites are not always the most hard-working or loyal. Let's keep our good folks and get rid of NSPS. PLEASE!
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80912
To Jeff below, who stated that "Industry has had it right for all these years; reward the performers and motivate the non-performers." You mean just like Wall Street, AIG, mortgage lenders, Enron, etc?
Right, got it.
Well Jeff, what if you were the really hard-working "performer" of the team, could prove it, and yet you still got rated poorly as a 2 or 3 with 1 share while the complete slacker next to you got rated a 4 with 3 shares because he's a buddy of management? Jeff, my idealistic friend, THAT is what many of us are being subjected to under NSPS. Your premise that only "performers" get rewarded under NSPS is laughable to the rest of us here in the real world who've been subjected to this system for three painful years now.
Nearly all commenters here agree that we can use the General Schedule to reward "performers" and help "motivate non-performers" by making them earn their step increases. Bottom line is we need to repeal NSPS. It has failed.
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80906
I hope that there has been finally enough discussion on the cons of NSPS. Maybe the current system with step increases needs some tuning,but when used correctly can certainly do a better job than NSPS any day. Steps are not automatic, nor are promotions, even in an upward mobility position. We just do not have savvy managers with enough management training, nor do we have enough managers who can separate a person's performance on the job, from other prejudices they as manager's personally have. I am not under NSPS but the spoils system is still alive and thriving in almost every area I have worked for the past 36 years.
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80901
I can only repeat the feelings of Ralph and others- we have no input on the standards nor goals we are to achieve. The self-development aspect is a joke- we are told to read a book- there is no money for professional development unless you are with the in-group. The standards are being increased in order to prevent employees from either reaching a level 3 or if you are a level 3 to keep you from getting more than 1 share. That can greatly affect your high 3.
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80899
Under the GS system, I felt like I worked for the American people. Under NSPS, I feel like I work for my supervisor.
I find more people moving around in order to get that 5% raise. People used to be content to stay in a job and get really good at it because they had within grade increases to look forward to.
I had a Government attorney tell me that NSPS was created to save money. I would really like to see some tranparency on that! Because I don't think that it has saved money.
If they would have taken the time and energy used on NSPS to use the GS system to its maximum potential, the results would be amazing I'm sure. The GS system is a good system. Supervisors didn't always get the support they needed to understand the GS and use it. Again, if the time spent on NSPS were used to support the supervisors in the GS system it would provide amazing results.
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80870
Two pluses for NSPS--it has forced military supvs of civilians to take an active role in their supvisory duties and performance appraisals; and it has forced civilians to be more accountable regarding his/her performance. The NSPS employee must write a self-assessment of his/her work accomplishments for the FY. This requires maintaining a journal. There's always room for abuse in any personnel system. Keep your journal and prove your worth. 99% of civil servants want to do a good job. Now's your chance to show everyone what you do and just how well you do it.
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80859
I love NSPS. Simply would I be making more under GS or NSPS? NSPS, check. Could it use some improvements? Check. Scrap it and return to GS? No way. I've worked under GS, Acq Demo, and now NSPS and NSPS wins hands down. One big problem is in spite of the attempts at education many (especially on this board) do not understand how this system works. Not the grapevine description of how it works but in reality. There are more safeguards built into NSPS to prevent a rogue supervisor from unjustly scoring you than in private industry. They just give you 2 or 3 percent and don't tell you anything else at civilian companies. If we go back to GS, what is your position going to be classified at? You may be at step 10 on day one. How about that?
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80855
This amendment (the Shea-Porter Amendment was passed by the House subcommittee a few days ago (June 17) and will go to the full House of Representatives, probably in late June.
What I haven't seen mentioned is that whether or not you want to see NSPS repealed, it is irresponsible to order DoD to immediately stop hiring under NSPS when there are numerous people in the middle of the hiring process. Some have already been offered positions, with salary offers set according to NSPS regulations; some have turned in notices to employers; some are probably PCS'ing to their new work locations. This Amendment has created confusion and uncertainty for many -- not just in DoD HR but also among many new hires and soon-to-be hired DoD employees.
If the Defense Appropriations Bill makes it through the House and Senate with this Amendment, I can only hope that someone has the sense to put in some provisions to allow DoD to go ahead and finish the hiring process on everyone who was already given job offers, and to set a reasonable future date to cut off future NSPS hires. Attempting to cut things off midstream was just plain irresponsible and may actually cause major delays in DoD hiring as well as loss of candidates who tire of further delays.
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80854
"It is frustrating to work your butt off while the guy in the cube next to you falls asleep and then get the same raise at the end of the year... In my experience the only people that complain about pay for performance are the ones you would expect to complain."
It is also frustrating to work your butt off only to get less of a raise than you would have under the GS system, to get less of a raise than "favorites" and higher-ups who didn't work nearly as hard, to fall further behind your GS counterparts year after year, and to see your retirement thereby effected as well. Therein lies the problem. If by "the ones you would expect to complain" you mean people who are against this type of corruption, I'm in complete agreement.
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80841
For my first 10 years I was a GS employee I always earned the highest ratings. Shortly after we converted to NSPS, I made the "mistake" of using my chain of command to report illegal personal business activity being conducted. I also reported 1 major security violation where classified information was distributed to over 200 unclassified computers. It was decided by management to handle it "in house" and cover it up. During this time I saved the unit over $10,000 in TDY expenses by volunteering to deploy without 2 additional people since I have the technical ability to do their and my job. My reward/recognition, a 3 rating with 1 share. Those who conducted or supported the illegal business received 4 ratings and 3-4 shares. None of these 4's ever deployed nor have my exhibited technical capability. In my over 25 years of work experience in the military, federal and state government and private industry, I have not seen a system so easily corrupted and simplifies the process to take care of friends or favorites who play along quietly and ignore illegal activity.
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80840
For my first 10 years I was a GS employee I always earned the highest ratings. Shortly after we converted to NSPS, I made the "mistake" of using my chain of command to report illegal personal business activity being conducted. I also reported 1 major security violation where classified information was distributed to over 200 unclassified computers. It was decided by management to handle it "in house" and cover it up. During this time I saved the unit over $10,000 in TDY expenses by volunteering to deploy without 2 additional people since I have the technical ability to do their and my job. My reward/recognition, a 3 rating with 1 share. Those who conducted or supported the illegal business received 4 ratings and 3-4 shares. None of these 4's ever deployed nor have my exhibited technical capability. In my over 25 years of work experience in the military, federal and state government and private industry, I have not seen a system so easily corrupted and simplifies the process to take care of friends or favorites who play along quietly and ignore illegal activity.
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80839
NSPS was supposed to provide an agrement between the employee and management on goals and expectations: these were handed to us and we were told to accept them. There is no agreement it is a dictatorship. We were recently advised that "only the best" would be promoted under NSPS so it would be expected for the higher levels in NSPS to receive higher ratings than the lower ones. Separation of powers was long ago considered the only way to keep government honest, yet we give power of the paycheck to individuals that can feather their own nests if they reduce someone elses paycheck. Good grief. How stupid are we?
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80830
Let's face it the GS system is the only system in the US that gave you a raise for not getting fired that cycle..."Congratulations Mr. Soin SO, you made it through a year without getting fired, here is your Step promotion". Please, let's not even talk about Pass/Fail. Under a Demo program and now NSPS I have reached a level that I could never have achieved under GS. I have always been motivated by my contributions to the War Fighter, but now I can also be rewarded monetarily. It is frustrating to work your butt off while the guy in the cube next to you falls asleep and then get the same raise at the end of the year. Cash awards do not offset the issues in GS, because in a GS/Pass-Fail culture most of the time they spread the wealth in cash awards also...so no one feels left out. Industry has had it right for all these years; reward the performers and motivate the non-performers. In my experience the only people that complain about pay for performance are the ones you would expect to complain.
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80822
Before anyone gets the wrong impression, I did reasonably well under the NSPS (DoD) system. I've always been a good worker, and gotten fair performance ratings and compensation under both NSPS and GS. However, that doesn't stop me from seeing the warts and blemishes of NSPS. My good fortune notwithstanding, I've seen a demonstrable increase in non-competitive promotions in my agency, which NSPS "allows", executives getting a disproportionate share of the NSPS pie, and very little transparency. I realize the GS system wasn't perfect, but NSPS right now legally allows more cronyism than the GS system could, with no accountability. I'm old enough to have been under Merit Pay, an earlier Pay for Performance system, which was a resounding failure. I don't see NSPS as being anything more than Merit Pay in sheep's clothing.
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80795
Don't get your hopes up boys and girls....a lot of difference between proposal, vote and law!!!!!!
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80790
Everyone needs to stop carping about NSPS and contact their representatives to support this bill. Find your representative's e-mail at https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml. Here is a suggested format to send:
Please support and co-sponsor the amendment to the 2010 Defense Authorization Bill introduced by Rep. Carol Shea-Porter, D-N.H, that would prohibit new jobs from coming under NSPS, and that would require the Secretary of DoD to either justify its existence or end it.
The NSPS is a complete waste of time. I am a DoD employee under that system and my supervisory chain and colleagues waste more time on it than they spend doing their jobs. Furthermore, it is not going to result in the "pay for performance" that was intended. It's going to result in "pay for puffery." Instead of becoming more proficient at their jobs, employees are now becoming adroit at taking the most routine and mundane actions and semantically transforming them into super-hero feats that have saved the government from certain destruction. It's a joke and everyone knows it's a joke.
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80782
Keep NSPS for the top managers (GS-13 and above include SES), it would be fun to watch them squirm, back stab each other and complain. Better yet let the employees rate their supervisors for a CHANGE, after all that's what President Obama ran his campaign on "CHANGE".
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80781
"Its amazing that the folks that purport to be there for the war fighter fail to realize the war fighter wants the landcrabs to be totally accountable. Besides the war fighter the taxpayers want CS to be fully accountable. the only ones that want to continue the old job for life mentality and annual raises based on attendance are the sub par CS."
Accountability does not equate to corruption, bias, lack of transparency and inequality in the method by which employees receive raises and are compensated, which is the absolute case with Pay for Performance. It also doesn't equate to employees under such systems falling further and further behind their GS counterparts, even for those who truly work hard. It's not simply "sub par CS" employees who are against PfP. It's also all of those who oppose such corruption.
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80765
Well, I don't like being under NSPS. I'm the only person at my command that perform the duties for this agency. I was given a 2 after working my butt off to make sure the program continue to benefit the government and customers. For the last ten years I have earn an outstanding evaluation and now to be rated only a 2 is a slap in the face. How unfair is that. The good ole boy systems needs to be done away with and if an employee is not performing his/her duties then the government should not be afraid to remove them. NSPS gives supervisors to much authority over a person's career. NSPS should be abolish due to the unfairness. Oh yea!!! and that big pay out, I got S120.00 of the most then 500,000 that what allocated. What's fair about that with over 27 years of government employment.
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80746
Its amazing that the folks that purport to be there for the war fighter fail to realize the war fighter wants the landcrabs to be totally accountable. Besides the war fighter the taxpayers want CS to be fully accountable. the only ones that want to continue the old job for life mentality and annual raises based on attendance are the sub par CS.
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80736
It is interesting to me that so many are against NSPS and yet when you take the reasons they state, they just don't wash. No, it isn't perfect but neither is GS. For those of us who perform and work hard, NSPS has given us an opportunity to be paid, through salary or bonus dollars, for the contributions that we actually made. All NSPS did as far as the "time it takes" to go through the performance management process is mandate what should have been going on in GS all along. How fair is a pass/fail system, which Navy has been in? Are all you GS in ARMY really top block, level 1's?? That is the GS system for you. And if you are lucky and live in DC, you might get a couple of thousand in a perfomance award or it might be your year to get that QSI that rotates around the office. Out in the bases and posts, they might be grateful for a $250 performance award. I don't think you will find many in NSPS, if they took the time to calculate what they would be making under GS today, would want to go back to a system that rewards longevity only!!!! Could NSPS be improved upon, absolutely!!! Should it be repealed? Absoluely not!!!!!
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80718
Also, let's not forget the problems that many of us have caused by disagreeing with these pay for performance systems. There are a lot of people in government who have dedicated themselves to enacting these pay systems. There are also many private contractors and whatnot who have a lot to gain by being a part of enacting these new systems. When people put up the stink they have, it has really caused a lot of frustration for all those people who are trying to get these new pay systems in place. And it has also caused concern and possible loss for those who have something to gain by these new systems. For example, I can't imagine the disappointment and stress that some in government must be experiencing with having to delay the further implementation of NSPS and respond to Congress as this article mentions. Do you really want that on your conscience? I know I don't. So do the right thing - let's all stop fighting this!
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80716
"[The measure] also would require the Defense secretary to prepare to end the controversial system, or submit a report to Congress demonstrating why it should remain."
You see folks, all the Defense secretary has to do is submit a report demonstrating why NSPS should remain in effect. I'm sure he will submit a report which has a positive outlook on NSPS. I'm quite sure he won't submit a negative report. We all need to stop thinking for ourselves and simply adopt the same attitude the secretary will have once he submits this report. We don't have enough faith in our government officials these days, so we all need to do our part, suck it up, and admit that whatever the secretary says is right and proper. This is all for our own good in the end. Independent thought and fault-finding will only detract from this. Don't make this an issue of fairness. It's an issue of having the enlightening experience of learning to obey. What we all need to do is start from scratch, and don't go into this with an attitude that there might be something wrong. Don't go in with an open mind, either. We all need to reform our preconceptions to assume right from the beginning that this pay system is right, and that anything our government officials say has to be right. The only thing that is wrong is to question or dissent. PfP all the way!
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80690
I would like to see how the rating are stratified across the different grades, I've never seen it, but all kinds of other stats are available. I bet you anything the upper echelons have a heck of a lot more 4s and 5s. This is not transparent government--it is a good ole boy system. My co-worker just got promoted into what use to be a GS13 position, but will still be making 12 pay. How is that right?
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80666
Everyone - Ask your self and others these questions. How does NSPS support the Warfighter?? How does spending more time and money on NSPS equate to a better value for the american taxpayer? DOD should answer how much does NSPS cost both in time and money?
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80647
I'm in NSPS right now after starting with the federal govt last year. Part of the reason I took this job was because of the "pay for performance" issue. I was retiring from the military last year and had quite a few offers to work on the outside, and many of them offered bonuses that were tied to performance. I didn't want a dead-end govt job that would just give me raises based on inflation and a paltry amount that everyone shared equally regardless of their performance. NSPS, in my case, worked. I received a rating of 4 and was paid more increase than the average and it was because I worked my tail off. The non-performers got 2's and weren't happy. By the way, the pay pool results were published afterwards and it was quite apparent that it wasn't all the managers getting the big increases. It was your regular employees that had worked hard. I like NSPS. If the govt gets rid of it, I will consider working on the outside.
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80632
The NSPS System MUST end! A Few adjust-ments to the GS system and it will work fine. Comments made by "NSPS and PfP are Great!" are not accurate. Agencies Have NOT had to deal with the lower quality workforces they now have, because managers and supervisors adjusted position descriptions prior to the transfer into NSPS and only those employees being targeted by supervisors were transferred into it...and those "favorites" or friends and relatives they wanted paid big bucks were hired under NSPS. All personnel agencies should check the accuracy of the position descriptions and determine with employees input if they are correct, many are NOT. OPM needs to go to Standardized position descriptions!!! Favortism, nepotism and the good ole boys group MUST GO NOW!
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80625
Here's to you Michael, spoken like a true government hating, union-busting, big business loving, I've got mine you get yours, government contractor, capitalistic Republican. Thank God your type of administration was just voted out, the one with the same ideology that led us into the economic mess we're in today!
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80600
Way to go WD. These are no doubt the same ones that follow their bosses around and kiss up to get the higher bonuses in pay that rightfully belongs to others.
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80589
Sorry, but I believe that NSPS should end up in the 'ole circular file. I do believe that pay should be based upon performance, but NSPS has several fatal flaws. Higher level reviewers should not have the power to arbitrarily raise or lower employee ratings to "level the field". The current system mirrors the USMC system of performance used for non-rated Marines who receive proficiency and conduct marks (Pros and Cons). Your RO may submit high marks, but as the process moves through the chain of command, the grading can be lowered without any justification. Sorry again, but been there and done that. The employee's performance is lost in the shuffle and the marks are averaged accross the board. Not truly pay for performance. The USMC has a generic "leadership" objective which we've been told that NODODY receives a mark above a "3". Funny, how the 3 amongst higher ratings averages in. Yup, do the math. Might have been born at night, but it weren't last night.
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80586
Has anyone thought about how much of the taxpayers dollars that could be saved by this "good ole boy" system? Mangers that don't do anything get the biggest pay raises and the the people that really do the work don't get anything and for the most part work really hard to give their supervisors a bigger raise.
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80574
So far, the only people I find who like NSPS are those who got in early. To me, it is like a pyramid scheme. Those who got in early got big raises and bonuses. As more people are moved into a pool (not with an increase in funding) people will start to see those high raises and bonuses disappearing.
The system lacks transparency. There is something fundamentally wrong with your rating being decided by a board that doesn't know the employee, rather than the supervisor who does. It's wrong that employees cannot discuss their rating.
At least under the old system, everyone in an office knew what grade their coworkers were making. How can someone prove that someone is being rewarded or punished for gender/race or any other non work related criteria? It's a big secret. . .
If everything is being done above board, there is no need for secrecy.
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80570
W.D. Jackson - Just as we are allowed to keep resume and "bio" on our work computer for government business purposes, so too are we allowed to use work time, and computer, to follow our pay system. No issue could be of more concern to us. Chiding Joanne and Tom was inappropriate. (And I happen to tilt toward NSPS.)
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80568
Louise B., if you work in HR, you should know that GS-15/10s' salaries cannot exceed SES Level 4 pay, so don't mislead readers into thinking that the former are earning upwards of $200,000 by $14,000 annual increases under NSPS.
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80560
Now that Dicky, Donny, and Dummy are gone, let's waste not one more second slamming the federal workforce who carried the ball through many a national emergency that make 9/11 look small potatoes. Orrr, on second thought maybe Mr Voinovich has a point. Maybe we need to bring the US Congress under the National Security Personnel System since unlike the civil servants they don't have a pay for performance system. Just think, after Mr V spents hours writing about his accomplishments his supervisors (that would be us voters) would get to decide whether he was just a "valued performer" or just write "I disagree" on his interim and annual assessment. Then we'd decide whether Mr V should stay where he is in the payband or if we should hold his pay back a little so we could keep a bigger part of the "pay pool". Or maybe we need to apply the National Security Personnel System to the uniform members of the military. They don't have the benefit of a pay for performance system either! Shoot, most aren't even full time employees. In addition to the 30 days yearly paid leave all the federal holidays, their leaders let them off with pay but without signing for leave either the day before or after federal holidays as a "family day". They're so special. Then there is the annual organizational picnic (day off), the directorate picnic (half day off not counting the time spend preparing), the division picnic, the branch picnic, the annual Easter holiday party, the office Christmas party, the Thanksgiving feast party, the Top Three golf match, the base appreciation day, their organiztion appreciateion day, fitness days, time to go get haircuts and go to the gym -- the list goes on for pages but you get the idea -- all on the taxpayer's tab without having to charge leave, all just a gift of the American people. Yes indeed, Mr Voinovich has a point. We definitely need a pay for performance system just for the military and the members of Congress since they don't have one. After all if NSPS is so good for the civil servants, then it should be even better for the members of Congress and the military, right Mr Voinovich?
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80555
NSPS and DCIPS--unending paperwork, classes, and town halls which take away from our work time. The GS system was much more streamlined and upfront. Step increases could be denied for poor performers and bonuses could be given. I noticed that in my agency, people stayed longer. DCIPS does nothing to attract and keep people. This pay for performance creates nothing but a dog-eat-dog atmosphere and takes away from our work time. We should be hepling the military, not spending ridiculous amounts of time writing "pretty" self-assessments. Besides, how "fair" is it, since all of this if budget driven? get rid of NSPS and DCIPS and tweak the GS system a little, or better yet, just go back.
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80553
My organization converted last year. However, they are creating/converting as many NSPS positions as fast as they can. I thought there were supposed to be no more conversions. It's the usual dirty double dealing I've always seen. NSPS is a joke.
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80552
Its nice to see the anti-union bloggers out there are as uninformed as they are intelligent. Regarding union participation, the majority of federal organizations that are being forced into a system have no say, no union, and because of the Hatch Act can't effectively lobby against those that have imposed the system. The main problem with ANY system is failed management either inaction against non-performers, the picking of golden boys or self promoting personal agendas. NSPS could be greatly improved if the employees rated the management and determine who receives raise. Then and only then would it be a fair system.
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80544
Hey WD Jackson, It IS the Federal employee's job to know what is going on in the Federal government; therefore it IS part of their duties to read government newsletters during their duty hours. How else will a Federal employee know what is happening in the Federal government that concerns themselves IF they don't read it in the Federal government newsletters!! We know the supervisors are not going to tell the employee(s). WD Jackson, maybe you are one of those "unqualified" supervisors. Who knows....
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80543
Jimsing implies that the auto workers are the reason the auto industry failed. Pardon. but is that to say that management & their fat cat compensation (and greed) had no part in that failure? Kinda doubt it. So does the American public. Joanne, how can you possibly admire the private sector so after such pathetic failures, greed and thievery across the board? Have you been following the news on any of this? Sorry but you can keep AIG, Enron, Countrywide, Bear Sterns and all the others 'best practices' and 'business models' Also, any newbies who never even wotrked under the GS system have no palce to comment on GS Vs. NSPS. They haven't experienced both systems, thus they simply cannot possibly know of what they speak. All they've heard is the anti-GS pap fed to all in the NSPS training. I've worked both private sector and public sector and while in private, I never saw anything that remotely resembles NSPS, or that took up so much valuable work productivity time in rating employees. This time investment wouldn't have been permitted in private. Nor would so much $ been spent on costly overtime for months on end while the pay pool meets and 'deliberates'.
-
80541
If it truly is the end of NSPS, they need to somehow roll back the "promotions by salary" so the those who had received all the bonuses will not be considered to be GS-15 or higher based on salary when all they really are are GS-14's. Make them lose their perq's - e.g. prime parking spaces.
They are also protecting their own when "...the legislation includes a provision preventing any reductions in pay. " They already recognize how inequitable NSPS has been and want to keep what gains they've made on the backs of those who were denied pay increases.
They will be penalizing all those who lost money when they were topped out in their paybands or who artificially were denied pay increases when they were 'rated as only 3' by greedy management who gave themselves 4's and 5's and sucked up all the money.
If nothing is done to rectify those ill gotten gains, it will be an OUTRAGE!!!
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80534
I can't believe the negativity towards NSPS and performance pay. The failure to accept this system and adopt the proper attitude is all due to focusing too much on fairness. Yes, the retirements for the majority under these systems will most likely be lower, as will the pay throughout their careers. Yes, many will get raises they didn't earn while others will work hard and fall behind. It is also true that these systems have turned away many of the best applicants who choose to go elsewhere instead of subjecting themselves to these subjective pay systems, thereby downgrading the quality of the workforces of agencies who have these pay systems. But at the same time, this has provided a challenge for these agencies to deal with the lower quality workforces they now have, and it's always good to be challenged. It's a noble thing for the government to do what's best for us by cutting the pay and retirements of so many, and making us accept that life isn't fair, seeing as many of us aren't strong enough to willingly do this. After all, with lower pay even while working hard, it's not just the employee who has to sacrifice, but his/her family as well. So this is good in that it will make everyone's family stronger and learn to accept injustice. Actually, if the government were to cut everyone's pay in half with the exception of anyone related to a federally-elected official, we should be strong enough not to dwell on that, either. I can't imagine many things that would be more uplifting than really exerting myself day in and day out and getting absolutely no raise and falling far behind colleagues who don't work nearly as hard. If that ever happened, I would consider it a great experience in humility, and also in knowing that my hard work would be used to support the less-hard working who actually get the raises. We must put complete and total faith in the government even if it doesn't seem right to us. Don't focus on what's right or wrong; the government is always right.
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80531
Yes Joanne I can see you are "Actually performing your duties" IF that includes posting on Govexec.com at 10:17 AM On Wed. June 17. Same goes for Tom Kuntz, "Actually earning his paycheck" by posting on Govexec.com at 10:08 AM Wed. June 17th. You must have been at home on AL and not on a government computer??? And what can you say to "Dems R. Jokes" except, Smart move not using your real name.
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80530
I have been in NSPS for about a year now, I have workded for the governement for over 18 years, and since we went to NSPS, our supervisors are getting big bonus's and raises and I am not getting a 1/4 of a bonus than I use too. NSPS is for supervisors, you can write whatever you want too about yourself and performance but if your supervisor doesn't agree, no matter what you say, NSPS will back your supervisor. During a class I went to the instructor had told us that, with all the performance appraisals they look at, they mainly look at what the supervisors write. (Bottom line) unless you brown nose and do all your supervisors work plus yours, you will not be recognised like you should be. Its the buddy system.
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80520
Joanne, the 'do nothings' can be fired if the "managers had the common sense" to document 'everything'. I know that managers can 'fire the do nothings' because I did it. Bottom line is: the Federal Government MUST have managers who will do their jobs. Oops, here we go again with the 'unqualified managers' not doing their jobs.
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80515
While the system is not perfect, I like parts of it. I like it requires people to work and perform. There is entirely too much dead weight and under acheivers in the government. Paybanding is far better than step increases and allows more flexability for an employee and government to negotiate a salary. I do not like the aspect of potentially not getting my 100 percent of my annual increase and that they tie a portion of the locality pay to it as well. Secondly, the awarding of points is not standardized as far as a dollar value. One department may value a point at 1 percent and another department at 2 percent. The 1 department may give a rating of 3 while the other maybe 2.
Discarding it would be a mistake. Revising it would be better off than that antiquated GS system.
-
80513
Wow! The nays certainly out weigh the yeas on NSPS. As one in the "system" and a HR/Manpower type, I find NSPS great. I see some problems however, it is in the management training and implementation that most of the flaws are found. A majority of the personnel I know in the system find this system more than fair and are receiving higher pay for their performance. Let the panel review before the axe comes down. Don't let some political union hack take away something for some re-election cash.
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80509
As a retiree of the DoD, I disagree with this move to kill this system. Had something of this nature been in effect when I worked for DoD, I feel it would have benefitted me. Those who are concerned are most likely the ones who want a guarenteed job for life and not have to put any effort into improving themselves or the position they fill. I have seen many of these, as well as many who deserve far more than they get under the current system. The produdtive employee would be rewarded and those who sit and wait would still get raises, just not as much. So, what is wrong with that? Once again, the Dems are looking out for their union supporters instead of the Defense agency and the taxpayers.
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80499
What happens to the employees that were put into the system and did not get a raise when they were reassigned which I didn't think they could do that, would like some information pertaining to that situation and had I been left in the GS system I would have received a pay increase this July which screwed up my high three years. If they change back into the GS system will any of us in this situation ever get compensated for any of the money that we lost being that us baby boomers are starting to retire including myself. This is terriable system it is the worst thought out unfair system I have ever seen, talk about fraud waist and abuse this system has it all I guess the Bush administration made out on this one.
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80497
The only people that are afraid of pay for performance systems are the non-performers. That is why the unions are so against it. If you had to measure their members performance, you would quickly see that they are the real source of the problem (as is evident by the demise of the auto manufacturers). If you are not willing to be measured by your performance then you should not be employed by anyone, much less the Government.
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80496
For all you NSPS complainers, there is nothing wrong with a pay for performance system. It works - if YOU work! The majority of these comments appear to be from people that just "expect" to get raises - as if you were "owed" something by the Govt for showing up. In any other business, you would be counseled and/or fired for not performing above expectations. Consider yourself lucky! You have a job that is paying most of you very well already, and if you go above and beyond, the raise and/or bonus you get at the end of the year will show it. If you do the typical day in and day out work, then don't expect to be compensated much more - that's your job! The only way the Govt is going to be able to operate efficiently and effectively to ensure our schools, public works projects, health care, national security, ect. are funded in the future is to act like a private sector business! That is to have people that outperform, bring innovation, new ideas, processes and new fixes to some old problems. The Govt does not need people that just show up for 8 hrs a day, take 20 smoke breaks and drink coffee all day (shocker but yes you people know these people exist in your very own office). Is NSPS perfect, no. It's definitely time consuming for the supervisors and employees due to the fact that you actually have to justify what you did, how it supported the mission or agency, and what value it's outcome was. But shouldn't all ratings be justified, even under the old TAPES system? A real problem with NSPS is the inability for personnel to negotiate within DoD for a higher salary like those coming in from outside DoD. That position's salary should be negotiable for any person. It doesn't mean that I as a manager need to accept it. I would only pay what I felt the job was worth. If I was so dissatisfied with my pay or my job as you all seem to be, I would try my luck outside DoD instead of complaining daily and expecting money to just be handed over to me because I am up for my next STEP increase that probably don't deserve! Now get to work and quit whining - your wasting my tax dollars! Save it for your lunch/smoke break!
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80493
I took an NSPS position that was a step up in resposibility and work load not realizing that the max pay raise I could get was 5%. By missing out on my step increases and annual pay raises, I was earning less money than if I had stayed in my old job. I was surrounded by folks making $20,000 to $30,000 more a year and doing the same job. I left the position and now nobody will take the job because it results in a loss of pay. It makes no sense.
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80492
For those who say the unions are the only ones who want NSPS to go away, I have to say you are uninformed. The unions are not in NSPS. I am an HR Specialist and NSPS is a nightmare. It does nothing but reward the top level managers, the former GS-15 step 10s who are now getting an average $14K raise per year. The idea was to bring up our intellectual capital, the new employees who are the future but they get the least amount of money in their annual payouts. As a GS-12 equivalent, I recieved a "4" rating with 100% of my increase going to my salary. That was great for me and I am not complaining but overall I can see what it is doing to the DOD workforce.
It is a waste of taxpayer dollars and we were much better off with the general schedule. Managers need to manage performance regardless of what pay system we are in. That means if an employee is not performing, put them on a PIP and remove them if necessary. They are not doing that anymore now than they were in the GS system. This system shuts down the government for at least two weeks a year while everyone rushes to complete their interim and final reviews. It's a ridiculous waste of time.
Your best employees are not going to take their time to write about themselves, they are working too hard on what is most important to them...getting their job done efficiently.
-
80488
Joanne,
Have you forgotten how your beloved "private sector" hands out massive bonuses to so many executives? Have you noted how myriad of these bonuses went to the very(!) people who drove their companies into the ground & got us into the economic mess we're in?
If you wish to criticize the GS system, fine. However, to imply that the pay system employed the the private sector is somehow "perfect" is misanthropic and downright absurd. If you think all those execs at Bank of America, AIG, Citibank etc all deserved the whopping bonuses they received (at taxpayers expense in the past yr, no less!), then you're WAY out of touch with reality.
DSR
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80487
I know there is a God!! I prayed that one day every hard working government employee would soon get treated like a real person. NSPS made our government employee 6/4 of a true worker. Unless a person is a manager in this heartless system, an employee would never be considered worth a 100%. It feels great that congress is now stepping in to take back some of that needless power management has misused. Now an employee can feel that their yearly contribution can count for more than just 60%. Never should three objectives describe the breath of work any employee including a manager will perform in the entire year.
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80485
The NSPS system has pitted employees against employees, created low morale, created hostile environments, created low incentive, created low productivity, created worse favoritism, created limited rewards for employees, created extensive paperwork for management, created mass exodus of early retirements which created lack of corporate knowledge, and created upper management rewards (those in power have the power). In my 22 years of government service I have never had to worry about performance because I want to work, must stay busy, and want to feel I'm contributing to our Nation. Now with the NSPS I am pitted against my coworkers, must come up with new duties just to be rated as a 3. Raises, promotions, and awards are limited to the pay pool and I could be reviewed by the panel who knows nothing about what I do at my job. I live in the DC area which is expensive and I feel the Cost of Living raise should not be tied to the NSPS. That is a very demoralizing issue.
A new Supervisor was hired in an office. The new Supervisor is responsible for the Budget but she does not know how to do it, so an employee must compile it yet the Supervisor gets the credit under the NSPS because only one person can be credited. The other employee cannot use it as part of her job duties under the NSPS although she is doing all the work.
Another situation: two young men were hired under the Intern program in May 2008 as Budget Analysts. One young man was given the duty of compiling all the analyst reports of budget info into one database for the Sections monthly report. The other young man cannot complete his report and must have the other young man to show him how to do his report every month. Which employee would you want working for you?
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80484
And who is going to classify all these positions back into the General Schedule? Many of the classifiers from the "old school" retired or have been reassigned to other positions. There are very few left who can classify a position using FES factors.
What is going to happen to all those individuals who got 5% reassignment bonus and various pay outs so their salaries are now in the GS-12 and GS-13 ranges and then they find out their position is really a GS-11. How happy will they be then?
The problem is always the system you are currently working in "stinks" and there is always something better out there.
People couldn't wait to get into NSPS since the GS system was soooo bad. Now you can't wait to get back.
Thanks you are keeping old dinosaurs permanently employed as contractors.
-
80482
I don't believe Shea-Porter cares about the dedicated federal workers unless it is to garner their votes. I believe she is simply a puppet of the unions but why should they care anymore since Congress has already directed that no additional unionized employees will be converted. While the system isn't perfect, it is far better than the current system where everyone gets a one block and a small performance bonus and then has to wait until they reach a time gate to get an insignificant raise. The people who benefit from going back to the old system are the poor performers who barely do their job and expect the maximum compensation. If you don't like the system, then try private industry where that is the only evaluation system and any raise you get is directly tied to your performance. People need to stop complaining in these forums and help fix some of the problems so it can be an even better evaluation and compensation system.
-
80480
The idea of pay for performance has never been a problem. As a matter of fact it forms a part of the current GS system (Quality Step Increases, Quality Performance Awards), even though this part of the system has been ignored for many years now due to lack of funding. Then along came the Bush/Cheney administration who hated "big Government". In their anti-Government fervor they attempted to force through a crony and spoils system under the guise of "pay for performance", because this was the type of power down mentality they were accustomed to. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge the above doesn't have a foot in reality. But unlike the previous administration, the current one is actually listening to, and getting input from, the major stake holders who have an interest in a system change and that's what I call a good start. Hopefully the current administration will get it right and make pay for performance a reality for the federal work force.
-
80478
I am an employee under NSPS and while the appraisals take more work, I am very favorable to the system. My bonuses under NSPS far exceeded any awards I received under the GS system, of which I was a part for over 19 years. I reject the notion of some that it is a way to protect favorites. I certainly am not a favorite! For the three years prior to NSPS conversion, I received no monetary awards. I never feel I have been treated unfairly, but I certainly feel better recognized under NSPS.
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80474
Has anyone noticed the majority of those commenting in favor of eliminating NSPS cannot spell or write a cohesive, grammatically correct sentence? Hmmmm?!?!?!
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80470
NSPS should be eliminated in it's entirety.
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80467
"Sen. George Voinovich, R-Ohio, a longtime NSPS defender, said it would be "premature" to eliminate Defense's pay-for-performance system."
Premature? Hardly Senator Voinovich.
The demise of NSPS cannot occur quickly enough. Please ntoe the findings that minorities receive the lowest raises and performance appraisals as an outcome of this system.
We cannot wait for some politician in an ivory tower to explain why. There are real people being hurt by this ideological boondoggle, and it needs to end.
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80464
Please make sure legislators use a SILVER bullet when they kill the NSPS monster so it never has another chance of raising its ugly head again.
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80461
Well, the unions may win, but the US taxpayers will lose. The majority of these NSPS employees are overpaid to start with. The private sector only uses pay for performance and doesn't ensure automatic pay raises to its employees. Even though a lot of federal workers do their jobs, I think we all know that there are many that are chronically absent, sleep on the job and generally do nothing all day. Why not just fire these nothings and save money for those that actually perform their duties?
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80460
I'd be interested to hear if Sen. George Voinovich, R-Ohio, or any of the folks in his office, fall under NSPS?
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80458
It would be ridiculous to go back to the old system. On that system,mediocre employees were given pay raises they did not earn. The new system requires employees to actually earn the paycheck they get. It would be a travesty to allow subpar performers to continue getting raises.
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80457
I have decided NOT to apply for vacant positions I wanted exclusively because they were NSPS positions. I know many others who feel teh same way. NSPS is excluding applicants for positions simply because there are too many variables left solely to a manager's discretion that are subjective ILO objective. Good ridience to NSPS. Get rid of it as sson as possible. George: I guess you don't have to wqorry about not being re-elected since you are retiring. You haven't got my vote the last two election cycles due to your attitude towards federal employees. I am a registered republican and voted a straight republican ticket until 2004 after Bush appointed Rumsfeld as OSD in 2000. I remember the Mayaguez andd how he left Hargove,Marshal, Hall and Loney behind to be captured and executed by the Khmer Rouge in 1975.
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80454
Sen. George Voinovich, place yourself under NSPS. Do not speak of your belief that NSPS should continue unless you participate in the system. I am sure you like your raises and pay benefits...so why would I expect you to come under NSPS after all?
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80453
I agree with it elimating the PFPS 100 percent. If you could change it back today I would be elated. I hated the PFPS from the very being because I was capped the very next year and was able to move to the next band to help commendate my high three! At least the 100 of annual pay raise help alot.
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80452
I was and am not in favor of the NSPS. It was thrown down our throats at the last minute.
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80450
I feel NSPS is a troubled system and should be abolished. It is a unfair system that cannot be applied across the workforce measuring an employees true work performance. It is a system that focuses centrally on a small number of objectives that an employee is expected to perform. Duties performed outside of the target objectives generally carries no merit. This being the case many are reluctant to give their all in accomplishing objectives not measured. An employee in the DoD should be measured on a catchall plan. How did the employee contribute to the DoD meeting its goals/missions. Since the DoD is worldwide a component should not be limited to a small organization. Example: Employees who transfer within the DoD are still part of the DoD and should be rated fairly for all their contributions and performance during an annual appraisal period. The mention of a closeout appraisal is generally ignored when applied against a employees new objectives. Questions: TexasSun01@att.net
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80449
This corrupt dem politician, Shea-Porter, cares not wit for the "dedicated federal workers". She is concerned about the lazy, incompetents that are not at all focused on performing - mostly those that need the protection of their equally corrupt unions. There is nothing wrong with NSPS as it is structured now. There have been growing pains with implementation which are to be expected. Another sad commentary on the disaster being wrought on our country and national security by the liars and incompetents in the democratic party.
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80444
NSPS is a bunch of baloney. I am classified as a GS12 equivalent but do not get paid even the lowest step of that salary. I have over 30 yrs of experience; the company I worked for folded during the recession. I can't wait for the economy to pick up, I was rated an average employee yet feel everyone comes to me for answers. I feel my supervisor doesn't like me and I don't know why. NSPS is a joke!
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80440
Could it be true? Could this actually be the death-knell of this corrupt and corrosive system?? I am holding my breath in anticipation. Make it so!
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80428
If Voinovich and these idiots in Congress believe that these Pay-For-Performance Systems are so great, why isn't the Congress getting paid for their performance???
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80419
Those who want to bring down NSPS are the union leaders who have kept their rank and file out of a very successful system. They do not want to admit that they did this to preserve their power at the cost of union members in DoD being blocked from participation in a very good personnel system. On the Hill, the enemies of NSPS are the members who are heavily supported by union leaders; they are not the members who are the supporters of all federal employees being rewarded for successful performance of their government duties.
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80417
Perhaps Senator Voinovich should wake up and smell the political wind. Perhaps he, who is from a state with a large number of Federal Government employees, should do a poll on the people of Ohio.
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80415
I firmly believe that George Voinovich if under this system would see it's folly, especially if he was getting less pay than others for doing the same work.
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80411
NSPS only ligilized management taking most of the bonus money and rewarding their Kiss Asses. Sen Voinovich should be under NSPS and get a 2 rateing for 8 years in a row. See how he likes loosing buying power. Or a 3 and loose 40% of your raise a year. At the end of 10 yeas he should be at the low end of the pay band and get the annual raise. This is a more corrupt system then any I have ever seen. No one trusts management now and they hve earned this lack of respect.
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80408
The only thing I have to say is, the people who want to continue this pay system are NOT in this pay system. Even the organization that started this pay system is NOT under this pay system. Why should we have to be? Thank you,
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80406
what about TSA's pay band system?
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80405
As soon as Congress is under NSPS and has to provide the voters with their personal inputs of why they deserve to be paid then I will agree to NSPS. Fair is fair after all. The system is filled with management misuse and should be disposed of.
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80399
NSPS and its close relative DCIPS are designed specifically to reduce DoD civilian labor costs at the full expense of the employees. If the pay for performance criteria were applied to our military members NSPS would never have been proposed. Under NSPS or DCIPS a reasonably productive employee could after 30 years be earning less than their starting salary when inflation is taken into account. Any time an "algorithm" is needed to ascertain how little of a pay raise an employee gets you should be very skeptical, compound that with a highly subjective rating scheme that is fraught with favoritism rejection of NSPS and any association with unconstitutional employee status (CIPMS)should be an easy vote.
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80397
I don't know of anyone that would miss NSPS. Most of us would be dancing in Times Square!
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80394
This system is the worst...NSPS will allow family members and good old-boyz to hire with-in. There are no checks and balances; why have we fielded a system that has tons of problems. If you work as a stand-alone employee isolated with soldiers, you will not receive a performance bonus, because no one is there to evaluate your performance. What happens if your name is place among the average in the pay pool? Pay for performance is great if you work directly under your supervisor. NSPS should be abolish due to the unfairness
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